Trial, Week 3: Summary - July 22


WEEK 3: JULY 22 - 26, 1996

   * Day 10: Monday, July 22                * Day 13: Thursday, July 25
   * Day 11: Tuesday, July 23               * Day 14: Friday, July 26 
   * Day 12: Wednesday, July 24


Edited by Roz Royce and Trond Halle, from notes by Trond Halle (Defendant)

Posted by FreeMedia

FRIDAY, JULY 26, 1996 - DAY 14

Abbreviations used in notes:

DC = Don Campbell (Defense)
SF = Shelagh Franklin (Defense)
GW = George Wool (Defense)
ST = Sheldon Tate (Defense)
MA = Manuel Azevedo (Defense)
HR = Harry Rankin (Defense)

LB = Lance Bernard (Crown)

No jury today - other court matters to deal with before break begins.

GW - tells judge that these coming weeks for the defendants' holidays is going to be rough on people and it's open for him to consider extra compensation money.

Lawyer for the AG says there is no change for these people. The AG's position is that there is no evidence to show that something is preventing people from returning home or keeping people here.

ST - says that people should still be compensated.

MA - (angry) say that it's constitutional right to be tried in place of arrest. Says compensation should still remain at $40 during holidays.

Judge says that he's responsible for public funds.

HR - says that practically speaking, getting welfare can take some time and since the last time we dealt with it, we did it practically. The same should be applied here. We're not talking law, we're talking common sense.

DC - says he agrees with MA.

Jones (Wolverine) - I feel the people here should be well compensated for what the RCMP did to them. Using the force they used, siding with the ranchers, this has to be looked at. Said this wasn't a land claim, and yet the rancher is having the property decided by the courts. And all we're talking about is peanuts. Native officers testified that we were seeking a peaceful resolution. When the RCMP heard we were going to have a meeting, they had to disrupt it. Is this a cover-up for what the Canadian government is doing? And we hear the Crown speak of the rule of law. This is what binds the country together and we can't use that. But the ranchers are too greedy. All we want to do is bring out the truth. We may not have a lot of money - but we've got a lot of heart.

Judge - realizes that the costs seem trivial, but these are public funds. Like before, is going to take a shot gun approach to this as encouraged by defense. Will take Harry's recommendation and will make the daily rate during holidays $25/day.

HR - reminds lawyer for AG that $40 will continue after break is over.

ST - asks this order to be tacked on to the old.

MA - This application to do with disclosures. Reviews requests. Reads Stitchcomb decision and says disclosures have not been timely, most relevant material has arrived after trial began. Earlier disclosures were irrelevant. Goes over the May 20/96 letter asking for a list of equipment used by the RCMP. Says Crown says it's in the army. Crown cannot remain blind. No excuse why JF didn't have an assistant. There is no precedent for common sense. Observes that the police are cleansing the material it is giving to the Crown. Asked on July 8 about Psychologist Mike Webster and has received nothing. Asked for grazing permit and these would have been relevant for Lyle James' cross-examination. Now he'll have to be recalled. Judge asks about Webster and MA doesn't know about him. He's rumoured to have been involved in Waco.

July 19, eviction video arrives on day of witness on stand. Why do we have to ask for this every time? Sarich's notes of plan finally arrived. Ministry of Tourism guy. Question of whether CIS files are complete. Wants total civilian involvement notes too. It is evident from this trial that the RCMP were under a lot of pressure to remove the natives. There has to be confidence that the RCMP are working fairly.

MA not even sure that 400 officers have been interviewed. We want some assurance that we have all the operational plan. No notes from Aug. 18/95 ERT probe where cops can't remember who sent them there. Defense position is they were scared away by horses, owls, the spirit. July 15/96 wiretaps list - some material released of interceptions but we want all. Not just accused, but all like Doc Hill and Ernie Archie. Re: Corbet's letter to the RCMP that 50% of reservations are down and that he's going to write a letter to the AG. When asked how this is relevant, MA says that if there are political pressures on the RCMP, that is highly relevant to an abuse of process application. Not convinced that summaries of radio transmissions are complete. Dale James refers to statement and final statement he gave to RCMP which we don't have. We also want photos that cowboy Scott Bernard took on June 13/95 during eviction process.

DC - Wants Findley's report but assumes that Crown will pass it on.

GW - re: Ernie Archie on video. Re: Cst. Andrew speaking of Cpl. Callander going around lake. Callander's notes don't reflect that. We've only got selected notes. Important to have timely disclosure. Otherwise we have to fumble through it like in an inquiry as you would have noticed. Suggest that we could have a mini-voirdire with the RCMP guy putting together Crown file and have him answer our questions. That could simplify things by finding out just what he has.

ST - Joins MA on application. We've heard evidence from native officers that change the defense's approach. Yesterday we received 1,000 pages of radio transmissions. Still don't have a no-go zone map. How can an Inspector of the RCMP authorize the shooting of a man in a no-go zone? Haven't a spec of info on criminal matters. We will only have confidence if we go to the source. Wants to go to this filing cabinet, and until he sees that, can't even argue.

JF - Doesn't dispute Stitchcomb. On disclosure list, only a half dozen outstanding. Crown doesn't feel they are relevant. Has to make inquiries. Would be irresponsible to respond if there isn't an adequate basis showing that it is relevant. Refers to past cases. Concludes requests are speculative. Re: letters to Mr. Zernhoff and Burton, and other agencies, Crown had replied they wanted clarification of request. Re: excessive force - what was used and under what conditions - communications not relevant. Speaks of the "air of reality"?? Re: list of people that contacted the RCMP, says that .... Re: wiretap list request - cites case that concluded it's mere speculative, mere conjecture - a fishing expedition. Refers to "yellow sticky" in the documents. List of witnesses much larger than those that will be called. Says the RCMP has decided which reports are relevant. No list exists of every person involved. That kind of list would take a long time. Re: Aug. 18/95 recce, letter only asked about operational plan, not who gave order. Re: Dale James, Crown ... Judge asks about tapes that made up radio log. JF explains that monitor logs are detailed and if Defense would ask for specifics, it would be easier.

Re: voirdire - that is not supported by the law either.

Refers to Wood decision saying you can't have whole police file.

LB - re: wiretaps - Crown doesn't intend to lead any of the conversations of the accused. Defense request for tapes - those are private conversations between 3rd parties which are protected.

GW - re: Ernie Archie - judge ordered disclosure of logs. Says it's highly relevant because he says the weapons in the camp are his while the accused are charged with having weapons. In logs, there is talk of him getting a new identity by his handlers. Especially relevant is where he says, "The police want me to say those aren't my weapons." Crown has already revealed that he was a police informant. Judge asks if this has already been disclosed. Only a partial disclosure.

HR - Brings up the army's involvement. They are in control of the information. Wants straight direction to disclose all information about the army because we need it to push the excessive force argument. Crown has power to order this. Equipment involved by the army, who invited it in, etc., to reveal the grand plan and who made the policy decisions.

ST - Insufficient to rely on Stitchcomb. Information the Crown has is not Crown property - it's public property. If these people had a colour of right and peacefully occupied it, what changed it to a criminal matter? If there was danger to life after the 15th of Aug., who created that danger to life? We believe it was the police. If the Crown states that they've reviewed all, then at least at the end of the day, if more information surfaces, than we can ask if it was done wilfully.

JF - doesn't say it's not in their control.

SF - states her position again that the court doesn't have the jurisdiction to hear the argument, but took jurisdiction anyhow. Since you have refused to address the law. Wants all notes and video and audio tapes with Bruce Clark. Any correspondence between Clark and RCMP (like Sarich and ______). Letters to Dossanjh. Any letters where he states the rule of law.

MA - This is not a regular case. This is 2nd time in Canadian history that army has come in to kill natives. Louis Riel the first time. And there is no inquiry here. Army things totally relevant.

Judge concerned that will take some time considering 2 week break. LB suggests a week okay. Judge will try to get it by noon.

GW - asks Judge to take jurisdiction and return Trond Halle's camera gear and other people's belongings without expense of having the government pay for holding them.

LB - takes offense to GW. Says he was approached long time ago and told him solution was to go up there and get it. Make an application to the court. Judge not prepared to make an order.

GW - says he can't be in 100 Mile House and here at the same time. Judge sure that RCMP will help him - he won't.

SF - has affidavit for her request for transcripts. Judge asks her to show it to the Crown. FRIDAY, JULY 26, 1996 - HABEAS CORPUS FOR JONES IGNACE GUSTAFSEN LAKE TRIAL - NOTES BY TROND HALLE

New Westminster Courthouse at 2 pm - Arrived late. Already started.

Mr. Justice Hall presiding

MA - Referring to previous judge's decisions. Says habeas corpus applied here because there was no legal reason to overturn first judge's decision to grant bail. You are only allowed to change bail if there are changes in circumstances. Refers to R. vs. Buckmeyer. Judge agrees that remedy of taking this to Supreme Court is not practical and expensive. MA says there is simply no precedent. Ignace is entitled to be held lawfully, and there is no other way to review or appeal it other than through habeas corpus. MA explains that Crown has revised end of Crown's case from Sept. to Oct. and that we are already behind schedule. Defense will mount a vigorous defense. Says Rankin thought this was the strangest trial ever.

LB - Relying only on R. vs. Pearson. Argues that habeas corpus doesn't apply here and says this should be dropped. Pearson says proper remedy is through another section - not habeas corpus. Says the defense is not prevented from reapplying to Judge Josephson if there has been a change in circumstances. Goes over history of previous reviews. In all cases, there was no change. Jones (Wolverine) stands but MA asks him to sit.

MA - Attacks Pearson. Unlike Pearson, section 520 is no longer available to Ignace.

Judge wants to read cases.

MA asks that a decision as soon as possible would be appreciated by the accused. Also, appeals court is in session on August 12th.

[ NOTE: The Judge ruled against the Defense. The Decision will be appealed. ]

   * Day 10: Monday, July 22                * Day 13: Thursday, July 25
   * Day 11: Tuesday, July 23               * Day 14: Friday, July 26 
   * Day 12: Wednesday, July 24